Which OR control bar to use on my foil kite?
Posted: 24 January 2012 03:55 PM   [ Ignore ]
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I have a 4m foil that I would like to use a control bar on.  I was told that this is possible, is it?  I will be buying an OR kite later but it will be after I get kite boarding lessons so I can learn my riding style.  What control bar would you recommend and why?  thanks

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Posted: 24 January 2012 04:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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sadly you can’t just use any bar and lineset on any kite.  you need to take into account issues such as triming, depowering,  safety systems, etc.  what kind of foil is it??

-wade.

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Posted: 24 January 2012 04:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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I have a Prism Tensor 4.2, it’s a 4 line kite.  I have heard of people hooking control bars up to them but didn’t understand how the power and depower would work.  Here is a review on the kite so we can see what the bar it comes with works.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jniRFMdGHwE
The bar the Tensor kites come with has the break lines in the middle and you steer with the front power lines which is where you get all your power.  If I hooked it up to a control bar I would have to swap the lines but then how well would a foil turn with the break lines?  To me it doesn’t seem like it would work.

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Posted: 24 January 2012 07:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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If I am right you have a fixed bridle 4 line foil. This is a nondepowerable kite which is the same as the majority of foils out there.
The power lines go to the end of the bar and the brake lines to the middle if you use them .
You can convet a OR bar to fit but it will be loads of hassel and I am unsure of the strength of an OR bar when the powerlines are attached to the ends. I suspect because it is OR it will be fine. You will need a fixed loop as per windsurfer.
In your situation I would look for a bar made for the job .
Why not stick to handles and hae a rope between them for you harness hook?
If you want more information on how to set up a foil snd me a PM

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Posted: 24 January 2012 09:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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This kite is de-powerable since you can split the bar and control all four lines.  I would like the control bar but only if it is safe.  I thought about hooking myself to the bar but if I do that and catch a gust I’m gone.  I am trying to keep this safe.  I think my biggest problem is the fact that when I pull my foils back lines I lose power were the normal c kite when you pull the back lines you gain power.  That is my understanding anyways. 
How would I hook a harness up to my handles?

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Posted: 24 January 2012 09:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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NOt an expert on things foil, but have had plenty of buddies use em in winter over the short history of kiteboarding around here.

Some converted from handles to bars and inevitably they were lower performance.  If its designed to ride on handles, keep it set up that way.  It will generally fly better and can still teach you tons about kite dynamics and power generation.  Have had some good times on fixed foils…. some pretty epic wipeouts too.  Survived it and kinda feel a little more well rounded for the experience.  Kites obviously have evolved tons, and true depower is a watershed inovation, but no reason not to have a fun little foil around.

I say use it as designed.  Once you have this sport figured out you can mess with converting it, but to try that before developing a practical understanding of kite dynamics sounds a bit like putting the cart before the horse.

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Posted: 24 January 2012 09:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Just because it has 4 lines does not mean it is depowerable . I don’t know your kite but I have yet to meet a depowerable foil kite which fly on handles .
Assuming the top handles go to the powerlines and the bottom lines to the brakes then you need a line between the rear loop on the power lines which can go under your hook. Also you do need leashes to the brake lines ( Kite killers). Best bet is to find someone local if possible to set you up.

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Posted: 24 January 2012 09:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Brent good point and I do like my foil but I would like to cruse the beach with or skis.  The whole conversion is to be able to ride longer.  After flying the kite for 15 to 30 mins in decent winds I am sore.  I want to be able to cruse down the beach for a few miles.

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Posted: 26 January 2012 01:41 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Definitely forget the bar, big downside, won’t give you what you want.

With your kite on handles, you can turn fast by banking and braking one side ( inside ). If you convert it to the bar, you turn only by banking, turning is slower without the ability to apply brakes to one side of the kite.

The power lines & bridle on your foil has a fixed angle of attack, pulling the brake lines in just deforms the rear edge of the kite, slowing it down, kind of like a jet plane putting it’s flaps down hard.

On a de-powerable foil ( Flysurfer, Ozones, etc )  or a 4-line tube kite, changing the relative position of front/power versus steering lines at the bar changes the angle of attack of the kite. On a foil, think of it this way - the bridle attachment points on a foil are usually denoted by a letter ( A’s near the leading edge, B’s below A, C’s below B, and Z’s on the trailing edge - the brakes ) and a number ( one on left side incremented across the kite’s span ). When you pull the bar in three units on a Flysurfer, the A points stay put, the B’s move closer one unit, the C’s move closer two units, and the Z’s closer by three units - the kite tilts, changing the angle of attack.

Pull the bar in with your kite, and the A,B. & C’s all stay in the same spot, just the Z points move closer, creating a foil with a lot of drag, slowing the kite down, killing the power.

With a bar, there is no way to harness your kite and maintain the ability to trim or depower with the brakes. As Richard ( Sunrise ) suggested, your only option is a fixed harness loop on the bar. Putting a quick release on that loop is your only option for releasing the harness connection if over-powered by the kite.  Plus you sacrifice turning speed - forget the bar.

If you stay with handles, and again as suggested by Sunrise, run a loop of line from the handle tops ( power line points ) to a harness, you can still depower some by tilting your wrists to pull in on the brakes. Again a quick release / shackle on harness would be your out if overpowered, plus a leash on one or both brake line(s). Ease into it, try it out on a light-wind day, get lots of practice in light wind and gradually progress to higher wind.

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