Bones - I have only mod’ed bridles on the OR One, but from that experience know that it’s an easy thing to do when using pulleys to split the loads and self-adjust to an equilibrium. I’m pretty sure the newer Cab’s use a 4-pulley bridle similar to the mod described in this thread, as a buddy of mine has a newer Cab that I’ve had a quick look at.
So I say, go for it. Use your newer 13m Cab as a model and scale a do-it-yerself copy onto your older 10m kite. Measure the 2010’s bridle lines, and for lengths of the new 10m bridle, multiply by 0.77 ( square root of ( 10 squared divided by 13 squared )). Provided the bridle attachment points on the kite are in about the same locations on the leading edge, it should work.
BUT first test flight should be in light wind at a very safe spot, no hard objects and lots of room downwind - safety first.
I think the originator of the One bridle mod, an Australian who goes by the name Wisha on this forum has done other kites, maybe PM him if you have questions about other kites.
Look particularly where the leading edge bridle attachment points are, where the pulleys are, total length of the front line bridle in relation to a wing tip (ie can it wrap behind a tip), and then the length of the rear bridle in relation to the front.
If the new IDS leading edge attach point is in between the older leading edge points, simply make a ‘V’ with two lines to create a new ‘pseudo’ attachment point to be in the middle of the two others.
The IDS Switchy bridles are about as good as you are going to get for low end power, jumping, gust smoothing and medium bar pressure. Pretty much standard self regulating bridle, kite can slide under the bridle for IDS to work. Move the front bridle back to the rear to make it lighter, better for unhooking but less depower, less low end, less depower.
No 16m’s done that I know about, but my latest mod to my 12m One was to re-sew the Leading Edge bladder pocket seam taking off about 3 inches of fabric at the middle of the kite ( seam moved 1.5 inches narrower, or closer to the canopy ), tapering to nothing at the tips. Now the One’s LE matches the diameter of the LE on my 12m Rise.
This has made my 12m One a little bit faster across the wind window. LE bladder is still stiff enough to hold the kite’s shape, no instability problems. No new problems that ‘ve noticed from this mod, unfortunately it still turns kinda slow.
Ha ha nice, re -sewing the leading edge, now that’s commitment! Re weld the bladders to reduce weight (super commitment!) Though quite easy with an iron between 2 bits of paper.
I’m going to try to get my hands on a 16mLW and see how we go.
PS. always will turn slow being so flat, however the more advanced I get the more I find this actually desirable (for wakestyle this is a good thing). Currently sending the kite allover the place during pasess :( never thought I would say slow is good.
Ya, I only took off fabric, haven’t trimmed the bladder down ( yet ). With the bladder out and a decent machine, it was an easy sewing job, since the existing seam kept the two sides aligned. Just measured the offset at LE panel seams, marked straight lines between those measurement points, ran a straight stitch down the mark, folded that onto a lenght of weed-eater line ( same LE seam construction as on the One, simpler than the Rise’s ) and ran another straight stitch to hold it down tight using a piping trim foot on the machine. then trimmed the excess fabric off.
I was concerned that this mod might shift the bridle attachment points too much under the LE, but doesn’t seem to be a problem.
When we get don’t get decent wind, I start messing around with my 12m One. And July has been very poor for wind, so ...
I flew it in about 10-15 knots with 4 struts un-inflated - flew fine, so off with those four struts ( wing-tips and pair right beside centre strut ). My 12 now only has 3 struts, evenly spaced, and it still flies great, much lighter kite now, re-launch is still fine, although after a heavy crash the wingtip canopy can be held down a bit with water, just takes a litttle longer to spin it downwind, fill the canopy and push off that water, and away.
Flies way better as a light wind kite, de-power is still pretty good, seems lighter on the bar, especially when parked and motoring along, you don’t need as much countersteering to keep the kite low and forward in the window.
Best part is its response when you ride at the kite. Instead of stalling and flying backwards when you ride down a wind-wave, it drifts nicely and climbs eagerly when sheeted out a bit.
Wisha, if you find that 16, you’ve got to lighten it up and take off struts. I will post a picture of my 12m flying next time I’m out with it, and details of steps required to remove struts.
Bridle Mod update : I’ve been thinking over the past few months why Wisha’s original longer mod would fly better. His mod had no bridle attachment at the center or first inboard LE point, whereas my shorter version has the A and B lines coming off at oblique angles ( same as factory bridle ). So I re-arranged the bridle lines from the first three points :
LE 1 - combined the C & B lines
LE 2 - new “P2” line here, lengths are 41 / 46.5 / 53.8 / 62 cm loop-loop for 7 / 9 / 12 / 16 m2 kites
These two lines join into D line and then one side of the V1 pulley line
LE 3 - A line, which connects to the other side of the V1 pulley line
Remainder is same as my original shorter mod. I made my P2 lines using Q-power line, making loops with an overhand knot and covering them with heat shrink.
Here’s a picture
This mod makes the front lines a few inches longer, and the kite prone to flying backwards if trim line is set for full power. Compensate by shortening the V2 pulley by about 4 - 8 cm.
I did this Modifikation and had a frontstall last time I went out. May be I made a mistake. I shortened the V2-Line (7m, now 135cm) by 6cm. Not the V2 pulley line, which is in my setup from f-One and fix 7cm long from knote to knote. Could that be the reason for frontstalling?How could I change the setup, to prevent frontstalling?
What do you think?
If you are getting front-stalls and want to tune this out with the bridle, change where the E and F lines connect to the V2 pulley line as follows :
- connect the F line on a knot closer to the end of the V2 line and where the E line is connected
- connect the E line on another knot farther from the end of the V2 line
By effectively making E shorter or F longer, the kite will fly with lighter bar pressure, de-power a little less, and be more stable ( less prone to front-stall ) at or near near zenith.
On my 7m I have the E and F line connection knots about 3 cm apart ( F connected closer to the end of V2 ). I find this setting gives a good balance between de-power, bar pressure, and stability.
If you don’t want lower bar pressure and less depower, then you have to always fly the kite with a slight load on the back lines to keep it at a positive angle-of-attack and a litle back in the window.
Hope this helps - the tuning on the bridle is easy, just do it on a mellow day when you can adjust, try it, re-adjust, and find a setting that works best for you.
Thanks for your advice. I will try it out.
What I changed already last Thursday was the following. I connected E and F a knot closer to the end of V2 (138cm).
I also connected the rear flying line at the bar a knot closer to the bar, so it’s a bit shorter (3cm).
All four lines (without the connector at the end of the rear flying line, measured with a screwdriver only through the loops at the end) now have the same length, when the bar is fully powered.
Then I read all the articles again about front stalling in the forum together with my son (basic advice: always keep little pressure to the rear lines).
Last weekend my son went out with the kite in Sankt Peter Ording. We had 23 knots up to 30 knots. I told him not to jump, and concentrate on back line pressure. And everything was fine. No front stall at all in three hours! After the problems a couple of weeks ago, he liked the kite a lot this time.
Next weekend we will kite again at Lake Garda. If there is “vento” in the morning he will give it another try. I will report.
Last weekend I was out in 26-35knt with the 7one and everything was fine with the new briddle-update. No frontstall, but I always kept line pressure to the rear lines. Wind was very gusty and there was no problem. Nice kite.
I liked what my 3-strut 12m has become so much, I’ve done the same to my 9m - call them Three-Sevenths now instead of Ones, but haven’t tried the 9m yet, will make sure next time there is some wind to take a camera with me and get some pics.